So much has been made of remarks made by pastors Jeremiah Wright and John Hagee and their relationships with Barack Obama and John McCain. Is this really what we need to focus on when we choose a presidential candidate?
Are these relationships of equal importance when compared the issues that face our nation?
Is Obama's relationship with Wright more of an issue than Hagee's endorsement of McCain?
Jonathan Blake
White Salmon
Wednesday, May 28, 2008
Presidential Candidates And Their Spiritual Advisors
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19 comments:
Spiritual advisors should have no bearing on a candidate and their qualifications as president.
I agree with the above comment. It is what the candidate does with any advice that counts. I think it is ok to discuss but not make a big deal of and not judge or assume... I know that Kennedy was questioned if he would obey the pope over what he thought was right for the country so this has been going on awhile.
There has been so much junk put out about all the candidates a person doesn't know what to believe. I would like to know about Obaba'z background. We do know is most of his Senate votes have been "here" no yea or nay. As for the other 2 candidates we know them and their background. I don't trust anyone who lauds their minister after spending 20 years listening to hate speach about America. Notice he didn't back away from him until his popularity began to slide downward.
Blue Bell
To anonymous:
Your comment regarding Jeremiah Wright, Jr., Obama's former pastor, is just the type of trumped-up non-issue that thrills his political opponents.
The video of Wright berating America offers the perfect vehicle for shallow, out-of-context sound bites that will be used to influence those who cast their votes based on headlines, political ads, rumors, religious attitudes, paranoia and have little or no contact with people outside their immediate social network.
First of all, Wright wasn't preaching hate or anti-Americanism for twenty years. That was one sermon, years ago, and Obama was not in attendance. More importantly, Wright is older and his experiences are far different than Blacks born since the 50’s. Any Black or Caucasian living together in Wright’s time understands his viewpoints. While Obama on one level surely understands how Wright’s viewpoints originated, Obama is of a different generation, a different heritage and a completely different environment. As a comparison, do you think most young men today view and treat women as their grandfathers did? Do you think that most young women view their role in the world differently from their grandmothers? While the young may understand on some level what must have shaped their elders viewpoints, their viewpoints are shaped by a very different world. It is one thing to hear, but another to follow or believe all that you hear – especially when it’s a message from a time and place you’ve never experienced.
Second, you probably have had little contact or personal relationships with Blacks. I have. I grew up in an integrated environment and attended school as a white minority. Until moving to this area, my closest network of friends was extremely diverse: racially, economically and socially.
Were you equally alarmed when Falwell blamed 9/11 on women’s liberation? Were you alarmed when Roberston and a chorus of Evangelical preachers were blaming 9/11 on homosexuals and women’s liberation? Were you alarmed to hear the Pope blame the world’s problems on independent women? Are you also dubious about those who attend these churches or accept their guidance?
As a non-Christian woman, I found these comments more vicious, brutal and vile than Wright’s tirade. Wright’s tirade is the result of horrendous actions suffered as a racial minority. The Christian comments were to demonize women. When at a loss of just who to blame, women are always an acceptable target.
Out of curiosity, let’s assume you were alone in a downtown Portland multi-level parking garage trying to determine which exit would place you closest to Yamhill. While you were searching for the correct exit, two young black men entered the garage not far from where you were standing. What would be your response? Quickly turn and walk the other way? Feel a sense of hopefulness and ask these young men to point to the correct exit? Your reaction will depend upon your personal experiences and only one side of the issue. If you turn and walk away, what message are you sending to those young men? If you warmly approach them for assistance, what message are you sending them? If you turn to avoid them, might they feel demonized? Ever wonder what it’s like to try and live honorably, maybe serve in the military and then provoke either fear or loathing just by walking into parking garage or down the street? Might this scenario somehow shed a little light on your concern with Obama’s true feelings? That maybe, just maybe, a bit of evil lurks just out of sight? Are you also looking for a bit of evil lurking in McCain or Clinton?
Sadly, when I read your comments it reminded me that little has changed. So much information is available but few bother to look more deeply at the most important issues facing this country and the world but instead will make a decision based on a sound bite, a rumor, a sermon or not even bother to vote.
Let’s continue the conversation.
Blue Bell,
I think the thing that makes you uneasy about Obama, his "newness", is the thing that appeals to me the most.
I see McCain and Clinton as two candidates that have made a career out of politics and I view Obama as an opportunity for an intelligent and fresh perspective to politics, and hopefully he will serve his two terms and be done by the time he is in his mid 50's.
Imagine what it would be like if people were in and out of the political arena before special interests could dig their claws into them?
As for the 20 year relationship with pastor Wright I don't hold any importance to this issue.
Although I don't agree with the pastor's position on many issues, and I don't "damn America", I certainly understand his perspective since life in South Chicago is not a bed of roses for those that are stuck there. If anyone questions this, I invite them to go and visit the projects there and see how they would feel to call this area home.
Also, the idea of the Government infecting the black community with AIDS is not as far fetched as you might think, if you dig into a little history and read about the Tuskeegee Experiment. From 1932 to 1972, the United States Public Health Service intentionally infected 399 African American men with the syphilis virus to see what the virus would do to them when left untreated.
Again although I don't agree with everything he said, I can understand some of pastor Wright's anger and distrust of the government.
I seriously doubt the entire 20 yers was filled with hate speech as well.....but you won't find that on You Tube.
I appreciate your honesty and your opinion is shared by many Americans but I think it is off the mark......this guy is the real deal!
Jonathan Blake
White Salmon
Very well stated, Jonathan!
This blog provides an important venue to dispel the myths associated with the presidential candidates, presenting fact rather fiction. Let's hope it continues to provide fact-based information while creating a learning opportunity for all.
I re-read my comment about Obama and could find nothing that suggested fiction or anything degrading or insulting. I said I would like to know more about his BACKGROUND. and I would like to know more of how he votes on important issues facing our country. As I understand he is for higher taxes and against drilling our own oil. As far as his color goes to me that has no bearing on his ability. Color has always been a non issue with me. I have never looked at a person's color I look at how they treat others.
Blue Bell
Blue Bell,
Since you're interested in information about Barack Obama, suggest you check out the issues page of his website: http://www.barackobama.com/issues/
Also, the library has copies of the books he's published (and sound recordings too):
"The Audacity of Hope"
"Barack Obama in His Wwn Words"
"Dreams From My Father"
Be prepared though, there's a waiting list... :-)
Blue Bell,
I believe Obama is for higher taxes but only for people that make $250k per year or above and is actually looking for a middle class TAX CUT.
I think from an economic stand point they are trying to mirror an ecomonic policy similar to the
1990's when the budget was balanced and the national debt was much lower than it is now.
As for the oil situation, you may be right that we may need to eventually drill in the US to supplement our oil needs......but drilling is a long term process that comes with no guarantees and we would need additional refineries to process the oil which takes time as well.
What Obama is working towards, which is a shorter term solution to the problem is, higher MPG mandates on autos manufactured and sold in the US, conservation and more emphisis for alternative fuels technology. All geared towards energy independance.
I think we need to wean off oil, and we can but people are going to have to make some choices. Not that it is for everyone, but I have recently purchased a scooter for our travels around town.
I love it (so does my son when we arrive at school in the morning) and when I went to the pump the other day I filled up my tank and it was a whopping $3.50! The scooter was under $1500 and the insurance is less than $100 a year!
The other thing that should be addressed in Washington DC is to take away tax breaks for corporations for SUV's and Hummers.......why not offer tax breaks for corporations and private citizens for purchasing hybrids and alternative fuel vehicles?
If you get a chance, watch the documentary "Who Killed The Electric Car"........it will open your eyes about oil companies and how they are trying everything in their power to keep us "hooked" on oil.
Jonathan Blake
White Salmon
Well John, to let you know I go you one better, when I go to town I walk. Saves on gas! For info I don't read what the person says about themself. I do the best I can to see what their voting record is. Obama is only a first time state senator and you think he is ready for the world stage?? I'm sorry but I don't.
Blue Bell
Blue Bell,
Good for you for the walking thing.....I will try to follow your example now that school is out for the summer.
We will agree to disagree on Obama's qualifications but lot's of people with longevity and voting records don't always make great leaders.
Jonathan Blake
BB,
Obama is not a state senator - he's a United States Senator - huge difference.
In a previous post, you asked for more information about Obama and someone listed links for you, or anyone else, to check out. Apparently you haven't had a chance to do that yet...
John McCain's been in Congress since 1981 and still doesn't know the difference between Shia and Shiite - obviously "experience" doesn't automatically make one a more intelligent, informed presidential candidate. GWB was Governor of Texas for 6 years and look where that's gotten us...
i am very concerned that Obama seems to give carte blanche to Israel. Until Palestine becomes a nation and is no longer under occupation, there can be no peace in the Middle East. Then, if we'd leave Iraq and Afghanistan, maybe things could improve. The American empire needs to downsize, or disappear. Can Barack do the job?
I'm sorry but I am not sure what your statement means. Obama hasn't done anything so far, other than try to reassure the Jewish community that he would be a friend to Israel if elected president.
As for his position on Palestine I must admit I am unsure where exactly he stands so maybe you could enlighten me.
Not too sure what you mean about the "American Empire" down sizing or disappearing either. Please expound because it sounds like you have an interesting point of view.
One thing you mentioned I find curious, is that you question if Obama can do the job and that we need to get out of Iraq and Afghanastan.....if you feel that way, his opponant has said as far as he is concerned we could be there 100 years.
I guess I would ask if you want to bear the cost of remaining in the middle east permenantly. It's expensive and destabilizing and personally I would like to see my tax dollars stay at home and help the economy.....because it needs it!
Jonathan Blake
White Salmon
The problem with the Obama tax plan is that although it is correct that he wants to reduce middle class tax rates, the middle class is no longer correctly defined.
Further, the idea that he is only going to increase taxes for 250k+ and up is unfortunately is not true. One of the first things he wants to do is increase capital gains.
How many people do you think that make under 250k+ a year that will affect? A lot. Sell a house you don't live in, sell some stock your parents left you, cash out a savings bond...
Further even if they find a way to stick to 250k+ only it will have create problems for small business owners. If you are an S corp or an LLC, the money you company makes (profit) is directly reported on your personal income. I personally employ ten individuals. If they increase my taxes 10% (as an example), I will have to consider whether or not I can afford one of those ten people. Chances are we will just have to work a little harder, but I am in a high margin business (software). Others may not be so lucky.
You should also consider that the top 5% of US earners already pay over 50% of the taxes in this country. By increasing taxes on them, you are increasing their willingness to horde their money versus spend their money. These are the people that drive the economy.
That isn't to say that I think Obama is bad. I don't. I like his message. I just wish it wasn't attached to this idea of "fair share". Frankly his recent "no lobbyist" speech was enough for me to consider him, even though I have never voted Democrat.
Any US Senator who doesn't know what Hanford is- the worse nuclear waste dump in the western hemisphere- is, in my opinion, not knowledge, qualified or experienced enough to be president.
McCain does know the difference between 'shia" and "shiite" just as my mother use to know the names of all her kids but for some reason she occasionally would have to go down the list until she got the right one. Didn't mean she didn't know what name belonged to which kid though.
My comments were not an endorsement for Mr. Mcain. I could just as easily retort that any person that has not served in the US Military does not deserve to be Commander and Chief.
I personally believe that Obama is a better candidate but I also believe that he, like every other politicians stretches the truth to get a pop from people.
I think they both suck.
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